Topics

WEFAX Decoding

George Stein - NJ3H
 

Greetings,

I am hoping someone can help me with this problem and shed some light on possible solutions.

The issue has occurred on my last two computers, an i5 Windows 8.1 and a quad core Windows 8.1 and 10 (dual boot) computer with 16 GB ram.

The receiver is a Perseus and using the native Perseus software and the SDR Console program feeding the signal to FLDigi.  It seems I am the only one in the world that has this issue as I cannot find anything else about this on google.

What is happening is the black bar curves (not a slanting situation).  This occurs about once per picture. You can see what I am talking about in the attached picture.

What is causing this and how does one correct it. As I mentioned this has continually happened since I started trying to decode wefax pictures 6 years ago using two different computers.

By the way, using the on-board sound card in either computer or my Sound Blaster Z, the problem persists.

Is there anyone in radio land that has any thoughts on this situation.  I would appreciate any feedback.

Regards,
George, NJ3H
Redmond, Oregon USA

Bill Walch
 

Hello George,

I'm not an expert on this, but I believe that the black bar represents the picture sync line, usually on the far left side of the fax. If the sync line isn't aligned with the picture edge, I think that Fldigi tries to re-sync the image which may account with the drift you see.

Bill

On 2/10/2020 9:33 PM, George Stein - NJ3H via Groups.Io wrote:
Greetings,

I am hoping someone can help me with this problem and shed some light on possible solutions.

The issue has occurred on my last two computers, an i5 Windows 8.1 and a quad core Windows 8.1 and 10 (dual boot) computer with 16 GB ram.

The receiver is a Perseus and using the native Perseus software and the SDR Console program feeding the signal to FLDigi.  It seems I am the only one in the world that has this issue as I cannot find anything else about this on google.

What is happening is the black bar curves (not a slanting situation).  This occurs about once per picture. You can see what I am talking about in the attached picture.

What is causing this and how does one correct it. As I mentioned this has continually happened since I started trying to decode wefax pictures 6 years ago using two different computers.

By the way, using the on-board sound card in either computer or my Sound Blaster Z, the problem persists.

Is there anyone in radio land that has any thoughts on this situation.  I would appreciate any feedback.

Regards,
George, NJ3H
Redmond, Oregon USA

Attachments:


G3TDJ
 

George...try using the FLDIGI "Digiscope Display - WWV" mode to test your sound card sampling rate against a standard time signal tuned on the Perseus

http://w1hkj.com/FldigiHelp-3.21/html/digiscope_display_wwv_mode.html

Once the sound card sampling rate is aligned so that you have a perfectly straight and vertical trace on the FLDIGI Digiscope you will be able to see if the "sudden" changes you observe in Wefax sync show on the Digiscope

Then you could perhaps isolate the anomaly by changing to a different receiver or using one of the many online SDR's

Andy G3TDJ

Paul Gulliver
 

Hi George,

Have you tried using a virtual audio cable to link SDRC and fldigi?
I receive Hamburg wefax on 7880 using an RSP1A, SDRC and fldigi and a vac. I don't have the problems you are seeing.
Also running Windows 8.1

Paul


On 11/02/2020 at 02:33, George Stein - NJ3H via Groups.Io <nj3h@...> wrote:

By the way, using the on-board sound card in either computer or my Sound Blaster Z, the problem persists.

Is there anyone in radio land that has any thoughts on this situation.  I would appreciate any feedback.

Regards,
George, NJ3H
Redmond, Oregon USA

Frans Maris
 

Hi George,

You are certainly not the only one struggling with this problem!

Besides, not only FLDigi, but many other fax- decoders meet the same problem. (JVComm32, SeaTTY, Black Cat Fax), so it is not a decoder-issue!

In my opinion it is a Graphics- or Soundcard problem. The synchronization is probably lost because the system is at the maximum of its performance.

Then, when some application is opened in the background, the decoder loses the synchronization pass it  received at the start of the image.

It is therefore important to ensure that you protect your computer from multitasking while receiving the fax image.

Putting the system offline (from internet or local network) helps a lot. You should  also avoid performing other operations during fax reception. So, don't scroll the picture during reception and try to reduce the zoom factor that makes the entire picture “fit” into the RX window.

If possible, try to increase the performance of your graphics card.

 

Finally I can also refer you to the website of the author of JVComm32, (FAQs) about this problem. http://www.jvcomm.de/mainframee.html

Frans
Zaventem (Belgium)

 

George Stein - NJ3H
 

I would like to thank each and every one who responded to by inquiry,  All responses were very helpful.

What I have determined relates to the Perseus radio itself. I did perform the WV test.  The adjustment was very easy to perform.

Using the Perseus, the curved (not slanted) line continually occurs.  This was confirmed using two different computers.  Improvement was seen by turning off the automatic centering in FLDigi, but this was not a quantum improvement to make it worthwhile to decode WEFAX images.

The next thing I tried was using my Elad S2.  An amazing difference. No curved lines whatsoever.  Something the black bar would shift, but the lack of the curved line makes it enjoyable to decode WEFAX again.

I recall a number of years ago my Kenwood TS-940S also did not have the curved line problem.

The Perseus still performs fantastically in all other modes that I use.  From Stanag, ham radio digital modes like JT65 and FT8, teletype, and all others.  So I can live with this issue.

I need to figure out how to use Virtual Audio Cable to have a dedicated virtual cable from the Elad using SDR Console to feed FLDigi.  That way, I don't have to have WEFAX being interrupted by other signals, music, etc.  If anyone has experience in doing this, I would be very appreciative for the steps required. 

So again thanks for the help and giving me clues to come up with a good work around.

Denis Stanton
 



On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 at 07:21, George Stein - NJ3H via Groups.Io <nj3h=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I would like to thank each and every one who responded to by inquiry,  All responses were very helpful.

What I have determined relates to the Perseus radio itself. I did perform the WV test.  The adjustment was very easy to perform.

Using the Perseus, the curved (not slanted) line continually occurs.  This was confirmed using two different computers.  Improvement was seen by turning off the automatic centering in FLDigi, but this was not a quantum improvement to make it worthwhile to decode WEFAX images.

The next thing I tried was using my Elad S2.  An amazing difference. No curved lines whatsoever.  Something the black bar would shift, but the lack of the curved line makes it enjoyable to decode WEFAX again.

I recall a number of years ago my Kenwood TS-940S also did not have the curved line problem.

The Perseus still performs fantastically in all other modes that I use.  From Stanag, ham radio digital modes like JT65 and FT8, teletype, and all others.  So I can live with this issue.

I need to figure out how to use Virtual Audio Cable to have a dedicated virtual cable from the Elad using SDR Console to feed FLDigi.  That way, I don't have to have WEFAX being interrupted by other signals, music, etc.  If anyone has experience in doing this, I would be very appreciative for the steps required. 

So again thanks for the help and giving me clues to come up with a good work around.

Max
 

VAC is a paid for add-on, but try the free VB-Audio first. Seems to work for most people on here. Creates a virtual audio "pipe" with an input and an output.

Just install and will become another audio destination option in the drop down audio selector at top of the DSP panel. With this selected, in the FLDigi options, make the input the VB Audio Cable output. This then routes audio direct from the particular SDRC receiver straight to FLDigi.

I have a "Future" request in with Simon to add an option for multiple selectable audio outs from SDRC, so if he adds this you will have more than one audio out from SDRC so that one of the outputs can be sent to the virtual cable, and one of the other outputs to the speakers for simultaneous monitoring.

At the moment the easiest way to hear the audio at the same time is to monitor through the app in question, so with FLDigi, find Audio options in the "Configure Soundcard" option, and tick "Port Audio" with VB Audio as the input, and speakers as the output.

When he is able to add it, Simon's multiple audio outputs on SDRC will cure the need for all the last part!

Hope it helps

73

Max



On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 07:21 AM, George Stein - NJ3H wrote:
I need to figure out how to use Virtual Audio Cable to have a dedicated virtual cable from the Elad using SDR Console to feed FLDigi.  That way, I don't have to have WEFAX being interrupted by other signals, music, etc.  If anyone has experience in doing this, I would be very appreciative for the steps required. 

Max
 

Forgot link to VB-Audio:
https://www.vb-audio.com/Cable/

73

Max


On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 01:41 PM, Max wrote:
VAC is a paid for add-on, but try the free VB-Audio first. Seems to work for most people on here. Creates a virtual audio "pipe" with an input and an output.

Paul Gulliver
 

I use Audio repeater for this, monitors any audio line (Vb or VAC lines) and sends the audio to speakers or any other installed output line whilst maintaining the feed to FLDigi or other app using the audio.

Technically this version is no longer supported but works Ok on Windows 8.1 - not tried on W10


A newer but paid for version is here  https://www.audiorepeater.com/

Paul


On 21/02/2020 at 13:41, Max <radiomax@...> wrote:


I have a "Future" request in with Simon to add an option for multiple selectable audio outs from SDRC, so if he adds this you will have more than one audio out from SDRC so that one of the outputs can be sent to the virtual cable, and one of the other outputs to the speakers for simultaneous monitoring.


Max
 

That is a very neat option Paul. Many thanks for the link. For info, the freeware version you linked to works fine on Win10 and I see written by same guy who wrote VAC (Eugene Muzychenko).
 
Do you know (can't see it mentioned anywhere) what is the difference between the two files, audiorepeater.exe and audiorepeater_ks.exe? I can see some differences when run but not sure what the actual purpose of the two versions is, and I don't see this explained in the readme file or on his website?
 
Thanks again for useful link.
 
73
 
Max

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 03:16 PM, Paul Gulliver wrote:
I use Audio repeater for this, monitors any audio line (Vb or VAC lines) and sends the audio to speakers or any other installed output line whilst maintaining the feed to FLDigi or other app using the audio.

Paul Gulliver
 

Hi Max,

Until you pointed it out I didn't even know there was a audiorepeater_ks.exe, I always use the audiorepeater.exe.

Looking at it now, if I run the ks version (kernel streaming) there are more options available but I wouldn't have the need for those so I'll just be keeping to the normal version. Sorry can't help further.

Paul


On 21/02/2020 at 16:51, Max <radiomax@...> wrote:

 
Do you know (can't see it mentioned anywhere) what is the difference between the two files, audiorepeater.exe and audiorepeater_ks.exe? I can see some differences when run but not sure what the actual purpose of the two versions is, and I don't see this explained in the readme file or on his website?
 

barry williams
 

If you go to the bottom of the VB page you will see links to Voicemeeter and Voicemeeter Banana. I've used both for years and recommend these programs to anyone.

Basically, Voicemeeter will create 3 control panel files that pipe audio. You select one from the audio menus in your apps. Banana includes an equalizer and wav file recorder. There is a good doc file.

The software is donateware. 



blw

-----------------------------------------

From: "Max"
To: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io
Cc:
Sent: Friday February 21 2020 7:42:44AM
Subject: Re: [SDR-Radio] WEFAX Decoding

Forgot link to VB-Audio:
https://www.vb-audio.com/Cable/

73

Max


On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 01:41 PM, Max wrote:
VAC is a paid for add-on, but try the free VB-Audio first. Seems to work for most people on here. Creates a virtual audio "pipe" with an input and an output.

M0ZEH
 

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 01:41 PM, Max wrote:
VAC is a paid for add-on, but try the free VB-Audio first. Seems to work for most people on here. Creates a virtual audio "pipe" with an input and an output.

Just install and will become another audio destination option in the drop down audio selector at top of the DSP panel. With this selected, in the FLDigi options, make the input the VB Audio Cable output. This then routes audio direct from the particular SDRC receiver straight to FLDigi.

I have a "Future" request in with Simon to add an option for multiple selectable audio outs from SDRC, so if he adds this you will have more than one audio out from SDRC so that one of the outputs can be sent to the virtual cable, and one of the other outputs to the speakers for simultaneous monitoring.

At the moment the easiest way to hear the audio at the same time is to monitor through the app in question, so with FLDigi, find Audio options in the "Configure Soundcard" option, and tick "Port Audio" with VB Audio as the input, and speakers as the output.

When he is able to add it, Simon's multiple audio outputs on SDRC will cure the need for all the last part!

Max, In vbaudio audio settings there is a tickbox listen to that allows you to listen to the audio being piped.
Thanks Steve m0zeh 

Max
 

OK thanks Steve. Useful to know but unfortunately for some weird reason I just cannot get VB-Audio to work with SDRC. It works with every other program I have, just not SDRC for some bizarre reason, so I had to pay for VAC.

But thanks anyway.

73

Max


On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 10:21 AM, M0ZEH wrote:
Max, In vbaudio audio settings there is a tickbox listen to that allows you to listen to the audio being piped.
Thanks Steve m0zeh 

Bill Walch
 

I too had the same problems, but I found that Voicemeter, which is like a VB-Audio mixer, can be used to monitor the audio through your PC, and works well with the free VB-Audio Cable version.
73's Bill

https://www.vb-audio.com/Voicemeeter/

On 2/22/2020 6:57 AM, Max wrote:
OK thanks Steve. Useful to know but unfortunately for some weird reason I just cannot get VB-Audio to work with SDRC. It works with every other program I have, just not SDRC for some bizarre reason, so I had to pay for VAC.

But thanks anyway.

73

Max


On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 10:21 AM, M0ZEH wrote:
Max, In vbaudio audio settings there is a tickbox listen to that allows you to listen to the audio being piped.
Thanks Steve m0zeh 

barry williams
 

I also had trouble at first some years back Bill. I've used it for about 6 years now and moved up to Voicemeeter Banana. Banana has more features. The whole scheme of Voicemeeter is simple, and maybe that is why I had problems at first. 

The only drawback I know of with Voicemeeter is that it sometimes simply quits working for some reason. I've learned to reinstall the program and get back to listening. I don't know why this happens, but it does. The fix is simple. You have to remember to reboot or you will be chasing your tail trying to figure out what is going wrong.

Vincent Burel is the programmer. He is friendly and offers support quickly. I had no problems sending donations to him. The Voicemeeter package is worth it to me.


blw

-----------------------------------------

From: "Bill Walch"
To: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io
Cc:
Sent: Saturday February 22 2020 10:30:15AM
Subject: Re: [SDR-Radio] WEFAX Decoding

I too had the same problems, but I found that Voicemeter, which is like a VB-Audio mixer, can be used to monitor the audio through your PC, and works well with the free VB-Audio Cable version.
73's Bill

https://www.vb-audio.com/Voicemeeter/

On 2/22/2020 6:57 AM, Max wrote:
OK thanks Steve. Useful to know but unfortunately for some weird reason I just cannot get VB-Audio to work with SDRC. It works with every other program I have, just not SDRC for some bizarre reason, so I had to pay for VAC.

But thanks anyway.

73

Max


On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 10:21 AM, M0ZEH wrote:
Max, In vbaudio audio settings there is a tickbox listen to that allows you to listen to the audio being piped.
Thanks Steve m0zeh 

_._,_._,_

Groups.io Links:

You receive all messages sent to this group.

View/Reply Online (#54102) | Reply To Group | Reply To Sender | Mute This Topic | New Topic


Please do not send e-mail to the developer - use this group!
Your Subscription | Contact Group Owner | Unsubscribe [b

Max
 

Hi Bill

I tried all the VB-Audio progs and all behave the same. They all work perfectly with every other program I tried but for some reason the audio from SDRC just never even gets to the VB-Audio cable, no matter what the flavour. I also tried Banana and Voicemeter. Same issue sadly. I must have a conflict somewhere in my system hardware between SDRC and the way VB-Audio handles things. VAC works perfectly. No idea why.

I have Realtek on-board audio which I am told by others sometimes can be flaky (although mine always seems fine apart form this one issue).

73

Max


On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 04:29 PM, Bill Walch wrote:
I too had the same problems, but I found that Voicemeter, which is like a VB-Audio mixer, can be used to monitor the audio through your PC, and works well with the free VB-Audio Cable version.
73's Bill

MadMike
 

Strange that you have these problems with SDRC, I run 10 audio channels from 10 Matrix settings in SDRC via VAC to 10 copies of MultiPSK. My computer also has Realtek on-board audio, and that does not appear to interfere with the settings.

Regards, Mike Simpson
South Penrith, NSW, Australia


Max
 

Hi Mike
 
Like I said, I don't have any issue with VAC but I do have an issue with VB-Audio...... two different cables from two different authors......
 
Anyway, only seems to be me so must be something unique to my system. Not a problem because now I paid up for VAC.
 
73
 
Max


On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 09:35 PM, MadMike wrote:
I run 10 audio channels from 10 Matrix settings in SDRC via VAC