RDS Detector & Database


Les Rayburn
 

I love the sensitive RDS detector on the V3.2 version of SDR Console. My only complaint is that in DX mode, it can generate a lot of false decodes. 

It occurred to me that one potential safeguard against this could be the same one that I utilize in the morning when going through the RDS database. Compare the callsign of the decoded station with the frequency. Unless that station or a known translator operates on the same frequency, it’s more than likely a false decode. 

Has this been considered in the past? Is there something I’m missing that would make this less than useful? 


73,

Les Rayburn, N1LF
121 Mayfair Park
Maylene, AL 35114
EM63nf

NRC & IRCA Courtesy Program Committee Chairman
Member WTFDA, MWC

Perseus SDR,  AirSpy + Discovery, SDRPlay RSP Duo, Sony XDR-F1HD [XDR Guy Modified], Korner 9.2 Antenna, FM-6 Antenna, Kitz Technologies KT-501 Pre-amps, Quantum Phaser, Wellbrook ALA1530 Loop, Wellbrook Flag, Clifton Labs Active Whip. 

“Nothing but blues and Elvis, and somebody else’s favorite song…” 


Jim Smith G0OFE
 

Hi Les,

False decodes is one of the downsides of having a very sensitive decoder. I guess it's the price nto be paid.

The key here is to have a good frequency database and keeping it updated. You can then double-click the entry in the RDS database and see if there are any valid entries in the Frequency database.

What I have done is this (it's somewhat convoluted, but very effective)  - I downloaded the frequency database from FMList and put it in a spreadsheet.

Within that spreadsheet, I did a CONCAT of frequency and PI code in a new column.

In a second sheet, I created a pivot table of the resulting CONCATed cells.

With the RDS Log, I exported it into a spreadsheet and copied it into a third sheet in the database document, CONCATed the freq/PI as before then did a VLOOKUP on the pivot table in sheet 2..

On each freq/IP code combo, if it didnt exist on the pivot table, then "#NA" is returned - those are (very probably) your false decodes. If you get any data additional to the PI code, then it is almost certainly a valid code, but missing from the database.

================================
Need help with SDR Console? If you have a problem:
Go to https://www.sdr-radio.com/support
Please follow instructions in that link.
===================================
Jim, Bournemouth, Dorset. IO90BR.
Elad FDM-S2, Airspy HF+, SDRPlay and Funcube Dongle SDR Recievers
8-element OP-DES for Band 2, 8-element LFA for 2m, 3-element LFA for 6m, 20m Windom for HF,. Wellbrook 1530 Loop for LF


On 30/07/2022 06:36, Les Rayburn wrote:
I love the sensitive RDS detector on the V3.2 version of SDR Console. My only complaint is that in DX mode, it can generate a lot of false decodes. 

It occurred to me that one potential safeguard against this could be the same one that I utilize in the morning when going through the RDS database. Compare the callsign of the decoded station with the frequency. Unless that station or a known translator operates on the same frequency, it’s more than likely a false decode. 

Has this been considered in the past? Is there something I’m missing that would make this less than useful? 


73,

Les Rayburn, N1LF
121 Mayfair Park
Maylene, AL 35114
EM63nf

NRC & IRCA Courtesy Program Committee Chairman
Member WTFDA, MWC

Perseus SDR,  AirSpy + Discovery, SDRPlay RSP Duo, Sony XDR-F1HD [XDR Guy Modified], Korner 9.2 Antenna, FM-6 Antenna, Kitz Technologies KT-501 Pre-amps, Quantum Phaser, Wellbrook ALA1530 Loop, Wellbrook Flag, Clifton Labs Active Whip. 

“Nothing but blues and Elvis, and somebody else’s favorite song…” 


Simon Brown
 

I could add a filter - if the PI Code is not in the database, then I could add a ? or something after the code indicating it's not confirmed.


From: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io> on behalf of Jim Smith G0OFE via groups.io <sdr-radio@...>
Sent: 30 July 2022 08:07
To: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [SDR-Radio] RDS Detector & Database
 

Hi Les,

False decodes is one of the downsides of having a very sensitive decoder. I guess it's the price nto be paid.

The key here is to have a good frequency database and keeping it updated. You can then double-click the entry in the RDS database and see if there are any valid entries in the Frequency database.

What I have done is this (it's somewhat convoluted, but very effective)  - I downloaded the frequency database from FMList and put it in a spreadsheet.

Within that spreadsheet, I did a CONCAT of frequency and PI code in a new column.

In a second sheet, I created a pivot table of the resulting CONCATed cells.

With the RDS Log, I exported it into a spreadsheet and copied it into a third sheet in the database document, CONCATed the freq/PI as before then did a VLOOKUP on the pivot table in sheet 2..

On each freq/IP code combo, if it didnt exist on the pivot table, then "#NA" is returned - those are (very probably) your false decodes. If you get any data additional to the PI code, then it is almost certainly a valid code, but missing from the database.

================================
Need help with SDR Console? If you have a problem:
Go to https://www.sdr-radio.com/support
Please follow instructions in that link.
===================================
Jim, Bournemouth, Dorset. IO90BR.
Elad FDM-S2, Airspy HF+, SDRPlay and Funcube Dongle SDR Recievers
8-element OP-DES for Band 2, 8-element LFA for 2m, 3-element LFA for 6m, 20m Windom for HF,. Wellbrook 1530 Loop for LF


On 30/07/2022 06:36, Les Rayburn wrote:
I love the sensitive RDS detector on the V3.2 version of SDR Console. My only complaint is that in DX mode, it can generate a lot of false decodes. 

It occurred to me that one potential safeguard against this could be the same one that I utilize in the morning when going through the RDS database. Compare the callsign of the decoded station with the frequency. Unless that station or a known translator operates on the same frequency, it’s more than likely a false decode. 

Has this been considered in the past? Is there something I’m missing that would make this less than useful? 


73,

Les Rayburn, N1LF
121 Mayfair Park
Maylene, AL 35114
EM63nf

NRC & IRCA Courtesy Program Committee Chairman
Member WTFDA, MWC

Perseus SDR,  AirSpy + Discovery, SDRPlay RSP Duo, Sony XDR-F1HD [XDR Guy Modified], Korner 9.2 Antenna, FM-6 Antenna, Kitz Technologies KT-501 Pre-amps, Quantum Phaser, Wellbrook ALA1530 Loop, Wellbrook Flag, Clifton Labs Active Whip. 

“Nothing but blues and Elvis, and somebody else’s favorite song…” 


--
- + - + -
Please use https://forum.sdr-radio.com:4499/ when posting questions or problems.


Jim Smith G0OFE
 

That's an excellent idea.

Or have a column to indicate a flag to indicate a frequency/PI match in the database, or otherwise.

It's a quick and easy sort once exported to a spreadsheet.


Jim.


================================
Need help with SDR Console? If you have a problem:
Go to https://www.sdr-radio.com/support
Please follow instructions in that link.
===================================
Jim, Bournemouth, Dorset. IO90BR.
Elad FDM-S2, Airspy HF+, SDRPlay and Funcube Dongle SDR Recievers
8-element OP-DES for Band 2, 8-element LFA for 2m, 3-element LFA for 6m, 20m Windom for HF,. Wellbrook 1530 Loop for LF


On 30/07/2022 09:42, Simon Brown wrote:
I could add a filter - if the PI Code is not in the database, then I could add a ? or something after the code indicating it's not confirmed.

From: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io> on behalf of Jim Smith G0OFE via groups.io <sdr-radio@...>
Sent: 30 July 2022 08:07
To: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [SDR-Radio] RDS Detector & Database
 

Hi Les,

False decodes is one of the downsides of having a very sensitive decoder. I guess it's the price nto be paid.

The key here is to have a good frequency database and keeping it updated. You can then double-click the entry in the RDS database and see if there are any valid entries in the Frequency database.

What I have done is this (it's somewhat convoluted, but very effective)  - I downloaded the frequency database from FMList and put it in a spreadsheet.

Within that spreadsheet, I did a CONCAT of frequency and PI code in a new column.

In a second sheet, I created a pivot table of the resulting CONCATed cells.

With the RDS Log, I exported it into a spreadsheet and copied it into a third sheet in the database document, CONCATed the freq/PI as before then did a VLOOKUP on the pivot table in sheet 2..

On each freq/IP code combo, if it didnt exist on the pivot table, then "#NA" is returned - those are (very probably) your false decodes. If you get any data additional to the PI code, then it is almost certainly a valid code, but missing from the database.

================================
Need help with SDR Console? If you have a problem:
Go to https://www.sdr-radio.com/support
Please follow instructions in that link.
===================================
Jim, Bournemouth, Dorset. IO90BR.
Elad FDM-S2, Airspy HF+, SDRPlay and Funcube Dongle SDR Recievers
8-element OP-DES for Band 2, 8-element LFA for 2m, 3-element LFA for 6m, 20m Windom for HF,. Wellbrook 1530 Loop for LF


On 30/07/2022 06:36, Les Rayburn wrote:
I love the sensitive RDS detector on the V3.2 version of SDR Console. My only complaint is that in DX mode, it can generate a lot of false decodes. 

It occurred to me that one potential safeguard against this could be the same one that I utilize in the morning when going through the RDS database. Compare the callsign of the decoded station with the frequency. Unless that station or a known translator operates on the same frequency, it’s more than likely a false decode. 

Has this been considered in the past? Is there something I’m missing that would make this less than useful? 


73,

Les Rayburn, N1LF
121 Mayfair Park
Maylene, AL 35114
EM63nf

NRC & IRCA Courtesy Program Committee Chairman
Member WTFDA, MWC

Perseus SDR,  AirSpy + Discovery, SDRPlay RSP Duo, Sony XDR-F1HD [XDR Guy Modified], Korner 9.2 Antenna, FM-6 Antenna, Kitz Technologies KT-501 Pre-amps, Quantum Phaser, Wellbrook ALA1530 Loop, Wellbrook Flag, Clifton Labs Active Whip. 

“Nothing but blues and Elvis, and somebody else’s favorite song…” 


--
- + - + -
Please use https://forum.sdr-radio.com:4499/ when posting questions or problems.


Simon Brown
 

Yes,

Will look at this today. Been out for 3 hours with George, he's crashed out and I must take a nap.


From: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io> on behalf of Jim Smith G0OFE via groups.io <sdr-radio@...>
Sent: 30 July 2022 10:48
To: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [SDR-Radio] RDS Detector & Database
 

That's an excellent idea.

Or have a column to indicate a flag to indicate a frequency/PI match in the database, or otherwise.

It's a quick and easy sort once exported to a spreadsheet.


Jim.


================================
Need help with SDR Console? If you have a problem:
Go to https://www.sdr-radio.com/support
Please follow instructions in that link.
===================================
Jim, Bournemouth, Dorset. IO90BR.
Elad FDM-S2, Airspy HF+, SDRPlay and Funcube Dongle SDR Recievers
8-element OP-DES for Band 2, 8-element LFA for 2m, 3-element LFA for 6m, 20m Windom for HF,. Wellbrook 1530 Loop for LF


On 30/07/2022 09:42, Simon Brown wrote:
I could add a filter - if the PI Code is not in the database, then I could add a ? or something after the code indicating it's not confirmed.

From: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io> on behalf of Jim Smith G0OFE via groups.io <sdr-radio@...>
Sent: 30 July 2022 08:07
To: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [SDR-Radio] RDS Detector & Database
 

Hi Les,

False decodes is one of the downsides of having a very sensitive decoder. I guess it's the price nto be paid.

The key here is to have a good frequency database and keeping it updated. You can then double-click the entry in the RDS database and see if there are any valid entries in the Frequency database.

What I have done is this (it's somewhat convoluted, but very effective)  - I downloaded the frequency database from FMList and put it in a spreadsheet.

Within that spreadsheet, I did a CONCAT of frequency and PI code in a new column.

In a second sheet, I created a pivot table of the resulting CONCATed cells.

With the RDS Log, I exported it into a spreadsheet and copied it into a third sheet in the database document, CONCATed the freq/PI as before then did a VLOOKUP on the pivot table in sheet 2..

On each freq/IP code combo, if it didnt exist on the pivot table, then "#NA" is returned - those are (very probably) your false decodes. If you get any data additional to the PI code, then it is almost certainly a valid code, but missing from the database.

================================
Need help with SDR Console? If you have a problem:
Go to https://www.sdr-radio.com/support
Please follow instructions in that link.
===================================
Jim, Bournemouth, Dorset. IO90BR.
Elad FDM-S2, Airspy HF+, SDRPlay and Funcube Dongle SDR Recievers
8-element OP-DES for Band 2, 8-element LFA for 2m, 3-element LFA for 6m, 20m Windom for HF,. Wellbrook 1530 Loop for LF


On 30/07/2022 06:36, Les Rayburn wrote:
I love the sensitive RDS detector on the V3.2 version of SDR Console. My only complaint is that in DX mode, it can generate a lot of false decodes. 

It occurred to me that one potential safeguard against this could be the same one that I utilize in the morning when going through the RDS database. Compare the callsign of the decoded station with the frequency. Unless that station or a known translator operates on the same frequency, it’s more than likely a false decode. 

Has this been considered in the past? Is there something I’m missing that would make this less than useful? 


73,

Les Rayburn, N1LF
121 Mayfair Park
Maylene, AL 35114
EM63nf

NRC & IRCA Courtesy Program Committee Chairman
Member WTFDA, MWC

Perseus SDR,  AirSpy + Discovery, SDRPlay RSP Duo, Sony XDR-F1HD [XDR Guy Modified], Korner 9.2 Antenna, FM-6 Antenna, Kitz Technologies KT-501 Pre-amps, Quantum Phaser, Wellbrook ALA1530 Loop, Wellbrook Flag, Clifton Labs Active Whip. 

“Nothing but blues and Elvis, and somebody else’s favorite song…” 


--
- + - + -
Please use https://forum.sdr-radio.com:4499/ when posting questions or problems.

--
- + - + -
Please use https://forum.sdr-radio.com:4499/ when posting questions or problems.


Les Rayburn
 

Simon,

Thank you, as always, for your amazing contributions to the hobby. 

This is an excellent idea and one that I would like to see implemented. Here in the United States, I generally can safely ignore decodes that don’t include the city and state of the station. But what happens most often while listening to meteor pings overnight is that the RDS detector will return a decode that shows the PI Code, call letters, and location of a legitimate station—however, when you look it up, it’s on the wrong frequency—meaning that the decode isn’t valid. 

Simply comparing the station's call letters and frequency to the VFO frequency is usually enough to determine that it’s invalid. If SDR Console could perform this function and add the ? symbol as you suggested, it would save some time each day. 

The Excel spreadsheet is another option, but it’s easy enough to look up stations here using the WTFDA database, so the Excel option wouldn’t really be much of a timesaver for us. 


73,

Les Rayburn, N1LF
121 Mayfair Park
Maylene, AL 35114
EM63nf

NRC & IRCA Courtesy Program Committee Chairman
Member WTFDA, MWC

Perseus SDR,  AirSpy + Discovery, SDRPlay RSP Duo, Sony XDR-F1HD [XDR Guy Modified], Korner 9.2 Antenna, FM-6 Antenna, Kitz Technologies KT-501 Pre-amps, Quantum Phaser, Wellbrook ALA1530 Loop, Wellbrook Flag, Clifton Labs Active Whip. 

“Nothing but blues and Elvis, and somebody else’s favorite song…” 


Simon Brown
 

Hi,

I'm adding this now. Just working out the most efficient way to do this.


From: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io> on behalf of Les Rayburn via groups.io <les@...>
Sent: 30 July 2022 15:24
To: main@sdr-radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [SDR-Radio] RDS Detector & Database
 
Simon,

Thank you, as always, for your amazing contributions to the hobby. 

This is an excellent idea and one that I would like to see implemented. Here in the United States, I generally can safely ignore decodes that don’t include the city and state of the station. But what happens most often while listening to meteor pings overnight is that the RDS detector will return a decode that shows the PI Code, call letters, and location of a legitimate station—however, when you look it up, it’s on the wrong frequency—meaning that the decode isn’t valid. 

Simply comparing the station's call letters and frequency to the VFO frequency is usually enough to determine that it’s invalid. If SDR Console could perform this function and add the ? symbol as you suggested, it would save some time each day. 

The Excel spreadsheet is another option, but it’s easy enough to look up stations here using the WTFDA database, so the Excel option wouldn’t really be much of a timesaver for us. 


73,

Les Rayburn, N1LF
121 Mayfair Park
Maylene, AL 35114
EM63nf

NRC & IRCA Courtesy Program Committee Chairman
Member WTFDA, MWC

Perseus SDR,  AirSpy + Discovery, SDRPlay RSP Duo, Sony XDR-F1HD [XDR Guy Modified], Korner 9.2 Antenna, FM-6 Antenna, Kitz Technologies KT-501 Pre-amps, Quantum Phaser, Wellbrook ALA1530 Loop, Wellbrook Flag, Clifton Labs Active Whip. 

“Nothing but blues and Elvis, and somebody else’s favorite song…” 


--
- + - + -
Please use https://forum.sdr-radio.com:4499/ when posting questions or problems.


Jim Smith G0OFE
 

During a big opening in Europe, I can have as many as 1000 decodes to go through after going through a recording of say 3 hours.

Automating the lookup can save a large amount of time!


Jim.


================================
Need help with SDR Console? If you have a problem:
Go to https://www.sdr-radio.com/support
Please follow instructions in that link.
===================================
Jim, Bournemouth, Dorset. IO90BR.
Elad FDM-S2, Airspy HF+, SDRPlay and Funcube Dongle SDR Recievers
8-element OP-DES for Band 2, 8-element LFA for 2m, 3-element LFA for 6m, 20m Windom for HF,. Wellbrook 1530 Loop for LF


On 30/07/2022 14:24, Les Rayburn wrote:
Simon,

Thank you, as always, for your amazing contributions to the hobby. 

This is an excellent idea and one that I would like to see implemented. Here in the United States, I generally can safely ignore decodes that don’t include the city and state of the station. But what happens most often while listening to meteor pings overnight is that the RDS detector will return a decode that shows the PI Code, call letters, and location of a legitimate station—however, when you look it up, it’s on the wrong frequency—meaning that the decode isn’t valid. 

Simply comparing the station's call letters and frequency to the VFO frequency is usually enough to determine that it’s invalid. If SDR Console could perform this function and add the ? symbol as you suggested, it would save some time each day. 

The Excel spreadsheet is another option, but it’s easy enough to look up stations here using the WTFDA database, so the Excel option wouldn’t really be much of a timesaver for us. 


73,

Les Rayburn, N1LF
121 Mayfair Park
Maylene, AL 35114
EM63nf

NRC & IRCA Courtesy Program Committee Chairman
Member WTFDA, MWC

Perseus SDR,  AirSpy + Discovery, SDRPlay RSP Duo, Sony XDR-F1HD [XDR Guy Modified], Korner 9.2 Antenna, FM-6 Antenna, Kitz Technologies KT-501 Pre-amps, Quantum Phaser, Wellbrook ALA1530 Loop, Wellbrook Flag, Clifton Labs Active Whip. 

“Nothing but blues and Elvis, and somebody else’s favorite song…” 


 

Hi SImon and others - from SW-Finland from Naantali-city.

I am very curious to see the difference on RDS detector on V3.2.
It is already working well in previous updates.

Here is a video-example from my remote-controlled-FM-DX-site in distant Jurmo-island, SW FInland.

The FM-frequencies are free there from other stations as it is located in the island in middle of the sea.

In this example there are FM-stations from Turkey Istanbul skipping to Finland from 2150 km distance.

SDRC with AirSpy R2 already pick up PI- and PS-codes very well!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quoL-Qbh9UY


73s Harri Kujala
Naantali / Jurmo
SW Finland







Nigel Pimblett
 

I too have found the RDS decoding on SDR Console to be excellent.    The one downside of tying the decode to the frequency is the case when the station is using the PI code for the originating station of a network rather than its own call letters.   I can think of a couple of small religious networks in the CO/OK/KS area that do that, and no doubt there are others across the US.    Checking whether the code is valid (regardless of frequency) would definitely be advantageous though.

73,

Nigel Pimblett
Dunmore, AB, Canada


On Sat, 30 Jul 2022 at 08:50, Harriku <harriku@...> wrote:

Hi SImon and others - from SW-Finland from Naantali-city.

I am very curious to see the difference on RDS detector on V3.2.
It is already working well in previous updates.

Here is a video-example from my remote-controlled-FM-DX-site in distant Jurmo-island, SW FInland.

The FM-frequencies are free there from other stations as it is located in the island in middle of the sea.

In this example there are FM-stations from Turkey Istanbul skipping to Finland from 2150 km distance.

SDRC with AirSpy R2 already pick up PI- and PS-codes very well!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quoL-Qbh9UY


73s Harri Kujala
Naantali / Jurmo
SW Finland







Simon Brown
 

Have this working, adding a refinement, test team kit today.


From: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io> on behalf of Jim Smith G0OFE via groups.io <sdr-radio@...>
Sent: 30 July 2022 15:47
To: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io <main@SDR-Radio.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [SDR-Radio] RDS Detector & Database
 

During a big opening in Europe, I can have as many as 1000 decodes to go through after going through a recording of say 3 hours.

Automating the lookup can save a large amount of time!


Jim.


================================
Need help with SDR Console? If you have a problem:
Go to https://www.sdr-radio.com/support
Please follow instructions in that link.
===================================
Jim, Bournemouth, Dorset. IO90BR.
Elad FDM-S2, Airspy HF+, SDRPlay and Funcube Dongle SDR Recievers
8-element OP-DES for Band 2, 8-element LFA for 2m, 3-element LFA for 6m, 20m Windom for HF,. Wellbrook 1530 Loop for LF


On 30/07/2022 14:24, Les Rayburn wrote:
Simon,

Thank you, as always, for your amazing contributions to the hobby. 

This is an excellent idea and one that I would like to see implemented. Here in the United States, I generally can safely ignore decodes that don’t include the city and state of the station. But what happens most often while listening to meteor pings overnight is that the RDS detector will return a decode that shows the PI Code, call letters, and location of a legitimate station—however, when you look it up, it’s on the wrong frequency—meaning that the decode isn’t valid. 

Simply comparing the station's call letters and frequency to the VFO frequency is usually enough to determine that it’s invalid. If SDR Console could perform this function and add the ? symbol as you suggested, it would save some time each day. 

The Excel spreadsheet is another option, but it’s easy enough to look up stations here using the WTFDA database, so the Excel option wouldn’t really be much of a timesaver for us. 


73,

Les Rayburn, N1LF
121 Mayfair Park
Maylene, AL 35114
EM63nf

NRC & IRCA Courtesy Program Committee Chairman
Member WTFDA, MWC

Perseus SDR,  AirSpy + Discovery, SDRPlay RSP Duo, Sony XDR-F1HD [XDR Guy Modified], Korner 9.2 Antenna, FM-6 Antenna, Kitz Technologies KT-501 Pre-amps, Quantum Phaser, Wellbrook ALA1530 Loop, Wellbrook Flag, Clifton Labs Active Whip. 

“Nothing but blues and Elvis, and somebody else’s favorite song…” 


--
- + - + -
Please use https://forum.sdr-radio.com:4499/ when posting questions or problems.