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Wax condensers

Allan Isaacs
 

After the RA!7 discussion a couple of old domestic radios arrived here for repair.
I chose the Columbia C301, reported as having been in the customer's garage for donkeys years, and which looked untouched since it was last used probably in the 1970s.
I decided to just replace all eight of its wax-covered condensers and measure them as a matter of interest.
The results were not unexpected.
http://www.radiomuseum.co.uk/C301.html
Oddly the two condensers that had risen in value the most were in the audio circuit with the worst more than 17 times its marked value and that being the one usually responsible for ruining the output valve.
Usually I find the more the change in value the worse the leakage.
But why is it that this particular condenser is so bad?
I notice C22 (0.01uF) is not a wax variety but a tiny plastic type. I'll swap that next. Maybe the designers thought it would be better in some way for tone control.. but why?
I guess an RA17 of simiar vintage would be not much different?
Allan G3PIY
Mag loop Simon
 

Hi Allan

Is this posted in the correct group??

Just asking as I expect alot on here will have NOOOO idea what you are talking about..

Simon
Allan Isaacs
 

Oops.. wrong group
Sorry
Allan

-----Original Message-----
From: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io [mailto:main@SDR-Radio.groups.io] On Behalf
Of Mag loop Simon
Sent: 29 June 2021 20:24
To: main@sdr-radio.groups.io
Subject: Re: [SDR-Radio] Wax condensers

Hi Allan

Is this posted in the correct group??

Just asking as I expect alot on here will have NOOOO idea what you are
talking about..

Simon
militaryoperator
 

Hi Allan

Is this posted in the correct group??

Just asking as I expect alot on here will have NOOOO idea what you are
talking about..

Simon



Ah modern technology and its users. 

Real pity such knowledge is thrown away for a handful of program lines.

Ben
jdow
 

Value may not matter nearly as much as leakage. Most of those caps would not matter if they were over value or would merely muck up equalization. Leakage would stop it from working entirely. (You subscribe to Mr. Carlson or whoever he is - replace all the capacitors or to "Radio and TV phono nut"? Loren once and awhile does the former and seems to have tired of the latter.)

{^_^}

On 20210629 10:20:31, Allan Isaacs wrote:

After the RA!7 discussion a couple of old domestic radios arrived here for repair.
I chose the Columbia C301, reported as having been in the customer's garage for donkeys years, and which looked untouched since it was last used probably in the 1970s.
I decided to just replace all eight of its wax-covered condensers and measure them as a matter of interest.
The results were not unexpected.
http://www.radiomuseum.co.uk/C301.html
Oddly the two condensers that had risen in value the most were in the audio circuit with the worst more than 17 times its marked value and that being the one usually responsible for ruining the output valve.
Usually I find the more the change in value the worse the leakage.
But why is it that this particular condenser is so bad?
I notice C22 (0.01uF) is not a wax variety but a tiny plastic type. I'll swap that next. Maybe the designers thought it would be better in some way for tone control.. but why?
I guess an RA17 of simiar vintage would be not much different?
Allan G3PIY

doug
 


On June 29, 2021 at 4:35 PM "militaryoperator via groups.io" <Military1944@...> wrote:

Hi Allan

Is this posted in the correct group??

Just asking as I expect alot on here will have NOOOO idea what you are
talking about..

Simon



Ah modern technology and its users. 

Real pity such knowledge is thrown away for a handful of program lines.

Ben


A LOT of people are not going to know what he's talking about. The word "condensers" has not been

used in the United States for about 70 years. We've been calling them capacitors since the 1950s.

--doug, WA2SAY, retired RF engineer
jdow
 

And Hertz rents cars. Cycles Per Second denotes frequencies.

{O,o}

On 20210629 15:17:42, doug wrote:


On June 29, 2021 at 4:35 PM "militaryoperator via groups.io" <Military1944@...> wrote:

Hi Allan

Is this posted in the correct group??

Just asking as I expect alot on here will have NOOOO idea what you are
talking about..

Simon



Ah modern technology and its users. 

Real pity such knowledge is thrown away for a handful of program lines.

Ben


A LOT of people are not going to know what he's talking about. The word "condensers" has not been

used in the United States for about 70 years. We've been calling them capacitors since the 1950s.

--doug, WA2SAY, retired RF engineer
Allan Isaacs
 

I’m showing my age I guess Doug, but at least I’ve weaned myself off Jars and now use microfarads.

As a rule I use a term commensurate with whatever I’m discussing so an early English 1950s radio has condensers which I perhaps replace with Chinese capacitors.

My copy of Schelkunoff dated 1944 uses “capacitors” which leads me to think the term originated in the US and everyone knows that a dictionary wasn’t taken with the Pilgrim Fathers… leading to lots of minor errors. Also the contents of the pint measure taken on that first boat had somewhat evaporated leading to the US problem over their gallon measure.

 

Now the UK has cast off from Europe maybe we can revert back to proper units ie. Kc/s, and pounds, shillings and pence?

Oh.. and I was taught in school that a billion is a million million, not a thousand million.

These new fangled units are really confusing. Tonight the Weather Lady said the Isle of Wight has had its heaviest daily rainfall ever at 53mm or 1.2 inches.. you can’t get the staff these days!

Allan G3PIY

PS… the post now rests with the WS19 group….

Must go and adjust that spark….

From: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io [mailto:main@SDR-Radio.groups.io] On Behalf Of jdow
Sent: 29 June 2021 23:24
To: main@SDR-Radio.groups.io
Subject: Re: [SDR-Radio] Wax condensers

 

And Hertz rents cars. Cycles Per Second denotes frequencies.

{O,o}

On 20210629 15:17:42, doug wrote:

 

On June 29, 2021 at 4:35 PM "militaryoperator via groups.io" <Military1944@...> wrote:

Hi Allan

Is this posted in the correct group??

Just asking as I expect alot on here will have NOOOO idea what you are
talking about..

Simon

 

 

Ah modern technology and its users. 

 

Real pity such knowledge is thrown away for a handful of program lines.

 

Ben


A LOT of people are not going to know what he's talking about. The word "condensers" has not been

used in the United States for about 70 years. We've been calling them capacitors since the 1950s.

--doug, WA2SAY, retired RF engineer

 
Robert Lorenzini
 

As it should and our biggest mistake was not following through on converting to metric in the 70's.
 We did at work making sailboat sails and it made everything so much easier and logical.
Bob - wd6dod

On 6/29/2021 3:24 PM, jdow wrote:

And Hertz rents cars. Cycles Per Second denotes frequencies.

{O,o}

On 20210629 15:17:42, doug wrote:


On June 29, 2021 at 4:35 PM "militaryoperator via groups.io" <Military1944@...> wrote:

Hi Allan

Is this posted in the correct group??

Just asking as I expect alot on here will have NOOOO idea what you are
talking about..

Simon



Ah modern technology and its users. 

Real pity such knowledge is thrown away for a handful of program lines.

Ben


A LOT of people are not going to know what he's talking about. The word "condensers" has not been

used in the United States for about 70 years. We've been calling them capacitors since the 1950s.

--doug, WA2SAY, retired RF engineer
John Cliff
 

Hi there to all readers. Just love it to think that all those Micro Henry Farads are evaporating in those old condensers due to them being rented out as cars. I stabbed a finger the other day with a no1 pozi driver and it still hertz, ups wrong spelling but it still hurts, good job it was posi and not Phillips. They are a tad sharper.Hi Hi . de John - G0WXU.


On Wed, 30 Jun 2021 at 00:55, Robert Lorenzini <bob@...> wrote:
As it should and our biggest mistake was not following through on converting to metric in the 70's.
 We did at work making sailboat sails and it made everything so much easier and logical.
Bob - wd6dod

On 6/29/2021 3:24 PM, jdow wrote:
And Hertz rents cars. Cycles Per Second denotes frequencies.

{O,o}

On 20210629 15:17:42, doug wrote:


On June 29, 2021 at 4:35 PM "militaryoperator via groups.io" <Military1944@...> wrote:

Hi Allan

Is this posted in the correct group??

Just asking as I expect alot on here will have NOOOO idea what you are
talking about..

Simon



Ah modern technology and its users. 

Real pity such knowledge is thrown away for a handful of program lines.

Ben


A LOT of people are not going to know what he's talking about. The word "condensers" has not been

used in the United States for about 70 years. We've been calling them capacitors since the 1950s.

--doug, WA2SAY, retired RF engineer
Oguzhan Kayhan
 

In Turkish we have both words..
kondansator (condenser) and kapasitor (capacitor) both used regularly.. 


On Wed, Jun 30, 2021 at 3:33 PM John Cliff <g0wxu.jmc@...> wrote:
Hi there to all readers. Just love it to think that all those Micro Henry Farads are evaporating in those old condensers due to them being rented out as cars. I stabbed a finger the other day with a no1 pozi driver and it still hertz, ups wrong spelling but it still hurts, good job it was posi and not Phillips. They are a tad sharper.Hi Hi . de John - G0WXU.

On Wed, 30 Jun 2021 at 00:55, Robert Lorenzini <bob@...> wrote:
As it should and our biggest mistake was not following through on converting to metric in the 70's.
 We did at work making sailboat sails and it made everything so much easier and logical.
Bob - wd6dod

On 6/29/2021 3:24 PM, jdow wrote:
And Hertz rents cars. Cycles Per Second denotes frequencies.

{O,o}

On 20210629 15:17:42, doug wrote:


On June 29, 2021 at 4:35 PM "militaryoperator via groups.io" <Military1944@...> wrote:

Hi Allan

Is this posted in the correct group??

Just asking as I expect alot on here will have NOOOO idea what you are
talking about..

Simon



Ah modern technology and its users. 

Real pity such knowledge is thrown away for a handful of program lines.

Ben


A LOT of people are not going to know what he's talking about. The word "condensers" has not been

used in the United States for about 70 years. We've been calling them capacitors since the 1950s.

--doug, WA2SAY, retired RF engineer
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