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ARGH! My stuttering is back on the SDR-iq's via remote

Stu C
 

https://iperf.fr/iperf-download.php

On a windows box it is enough to extract the files on BOTH machines you want to test (make it somewhere easy to get to, no spaces in the route)
then using the command prompt cd to your directory (lets imagine c:\iperfdirectory) and start it.

Machine 1
cd c:\iperfdirectory
iperf3 -s (that starts the iperf server with all defaults)

Machine 2
cd c:\iperfdirectory
iperf3 -c 192.168.x.x (that starts the client and you adjust the ip address to reflect that of the other machine)

That should give you some idea of the simple bandwidth on the route between two machines (assuming the AV/firewalls don't get in the way)


Stu

On 09/12/2018 19:29, Kriss Kliegle wrote:
Good afternoon Joe,

Looks like the speed and errors are in check?

I pinged the distant SDR-iq #2 & #3 server (which now works via compression turned on) and got this:




And I now get this on the AirSpyHF+ server, which stutters unless client machine is actively browsing the web: (Note, had to modify the windows firewall rules to allow it to be pinged, even though fire wall is supposedly OFF!




73 Kriss KA1GJU

Kriss Kliegle
 

Good afternoon Joe,

Looks like the speed and errors are in check?

I pinged the distant SDR-iq #2 & #3 server (which now works via compression turned on) and got this:




And I now get this on the AirSpyHF+ server, which stutters unless client machine is actively browsing the web: (Note, had to modify the windows firewall rules to allow it to be pinged, even though fire wall is supposedly OFF!




73 Kriss KA1GJU

Joe Puma
 

Turning on compression sounds more like a compromise then addressing the issue. If you’re on a Gigabit network or even 100base T, that should be more then enough to stream IQ data which is roughly 30-40mbps that I see when using rtl-tcp with my SDR with a 2mhz bandwidth. 

I’ve been following this thread here and there and don’t know the full scope of things you’ve done. but I would try to get some tools that will do a network Speedtest between two computers and see how fast data is being transferred between those two points. Latency can be an issue but if you’re seeing a few ms all around you should fine there. DNS and DHCP is inapplicable here, DNS caches your resolves so it keeps the IP of any dns host you connect to.  A router can play a big role in this because the computers constantly have to route through the router. Are both computers using the same router? Cheap ethernet could be a culprit but you said you ran cat6 which is overkill unless your dong gigabit but even cat 5e is sufficient. 

I take it that these devices run fine locally and that the USB bus don’t need much investigating. Doing a Speedtest between the two points is the best sanity check you can do to rule out the network being the issue. Lastly I’ve seen a wacky windows enviorment cause issues like this, be it the sound drivers or whatever, but a OS re-install cleared that up.  Good luck im looking forward to hearing you resolved your problems. 


Joe



On Dec 9, 2018, at 12:07 PM, Kriss Kliegle <kliegle@...> wrote:

All my servers use https://freedns.afraid.org/
because my IP changes monthly or even more frequently. So far it's been keeping up. OTW users (and myself) had to re-do all five of the definitions... a royal PIA.

GOOD NEWS!!! Well, sorta...

The thought had occurred to me about the use of compression, so I checked the network settings of the server manager.
The SDR-iq #2 & #3 server was configured with LAN users NOT to use compression:



Not sure when that changed, since I was using a WiFi link prior to pulling CAT6 ethernet cable out to repeater shed. So I
turned on the compression and now works 100% from Client #1 computer. Have to go out to barn and test Client #2 in while.

So, that's the GOOD news.... but AirSpyHF+ still stutters, even with compression on and bandwidth cranked down.

My learning moment of the day:
Check your settings at the SERVER end of the chain, use compression!

73 Kriss KA1GJU

Kriss Kliegle
 

All my servers use https://freedns.afraid.org/
because my IP changes monthly or even more frequently. So far it's been keeping up. OTW users (and myself) had to re-do all five of the definitions... a royal PIA.

GOOD NEWS!!! Well, sorta...

The thought had occurred to me about the use of compression, so I checked the network settings of the server manager.
The SDR-iq #2 & #3 server was configured with LAN users NOT to use compression:



Not sure when that changed, since I was using a WiFi link prior to pulling CAT6 ethernet cable out to repeater shed. So I
turned on the compression and now works 100% from Client #1 computer. Have to go out to barn and test Client #2 in while.

So, that's the GOOD news.... but AirSpyHF+ still stutters, even with compression on and bandwidth cranked down.

My learning moment of the day:
Check your settings at the SERVER end of the chain, use compression!

73 Kriss KA1GJU

Paul Mclaren MM0ZBH
 

Another random question.   What DNS servers are you using?

Are you connectong to your Airspy by an IP address or url/FQDN?

Regards

Paul

On Sun, 9 Dec 2018 at 13:35, <herbk@...> wrote:
Well:
I opened a wireless client in the LAN and selected my Airspy HF+ to the normal excessive audio stuttering and then opened a chrome browser and several tabs only to find the stuttering basically gone.
Latency, as well, WWV right on the money.

The server computer happened to be in use with the chrome browser opened (and in use) as well.

I will pay around with this (and various clients / servers) the next several days but left wondering if this is a workaround. This seems encouraging.

Herb

herbk@...
 

Well:
I opened a wireless client in the LAN and selected my Airspy HF+ to the normal excessive audio stuttering and then opened a chrome browser and several tabs only to find the stuttering basically gone.
Latency, as well, WWV right on the money.

The server computer happened to be in use with the chrome browser opened (and in use) as well.

I will pay around with this (and various clients / servers) the next several days but left wondering if this is a workaround. This seems encouraging.

Herb

Oidar
 

Hi Criss.
I dont se any foreign addresses on the local subnet, is this captured when there is any active connection to the server?
Are you shure the gateway and subnets is configured right on all clients and servers?

- A simple test might be to use "ping -t" to continuously ping between the client and the server, If the time fluctuates when the stuttering occurs it might indicate problems with cabling, switches and network adapters.
- Another simple test is to use "NETSTAT -e -s" and repeatedly refresh by using F3 and enter (this works only if you have focus on the command prompt). Use some normal browsing to "learn" what numbers are counting normally, then use the problematic SDR to look if any unusual numbers are counting.
- All commands above are based on Window$ environment, if you are using another OS the may differ.

Wirehark is a good tool, but there is a learning curve to be able to capture the "ugly fish" in the flood of all kinds of fishes.

Another wild guess, are you using any kind of VPN service?
Make sure you dont "listen to your radio" thru a VPN tunnel, which might cause weird and erratic delays.

Good luck
//Mats

Kriss Kliegle
 

Removing the switch in office (next to Client PC #1) in above diagram, still same results on AirspyHF+. In this layout, client PC and server PC are fed directly to the ISP router!
SDR-iq #2 &#3 have one less switch in the loop, yet still stutter, no change.

Beginning to think it's something in the two desktop client PC's?
Websurfing makes it better, but once I go back to SDCR to make an adjustment, it stutters severely again.

Kriss KA1GJU

Kriss Kliegle
 

The two servers that were acting up were not allowing me to 'ping' them, got that fixed and still stutters from Client PC. Although opening up Chrome brower reduces the stuttering to where its readable, but still there.
Going to eliminate the switch on Client PC for test now...

73 Kriss KA1GJU

Joe Puma
 

Have you tried rtl_tcp? I don’t have faith in other IQ streamers. Rtl_tcp been the best low latency IQ server I ever used and I’ve tried them all. Except Simons latest offering of his server. I just haven’t had the need to fix what’s not broken. 

Joe



On Dec 8, 2018, at 7:36 AM, Kriss Kliegle <kliegle@...> wrote:

Yes, IPV4 network, all servers have a fixed IP (won't work outside via the WAN without them)
I even removed a switch and a LynkSys (DD-WRT flashed) router and problem still remained (see diagram above in msg #44315) between Client computer #1 and SDR-iq Server #2 & #3. Still the same behavior, but if I connect to any of my SDRplays, (SDRPlay #2 is not shown on the above diagram since it was removed for testing) no issues what so ever going through the same series of switches at 1 MHz bandwidth.

I do have long runs of CAT6 from house to barn ~250' and from barn to repeater shed ~150', but as previously mentioned some SDR's work fine and some not so good via select clients. I spend most of my computer time using my XYL's 10 yr old Laptop, the one running the AirspyHF+ server. That old machine accesses all my SDR's just fine, go figure!

Will try the NETSTAT diagnostics this AM....

73 Kriss KA1GJU

Paul Mclaren MM0ZBH
 

Cornel, assuming Kriss is running fixed up addressed across all devices that should not be an issue as no DHCP lease requests will be sent.  In theory!

Kriss - another network basic unless you have done it already run a ping 192.168.x.x -t from each client to the server and see if the response rates vary widely and correlate to periods of poor performance.   Replace 192.168.x.x with the IP address of the server.  If it shows something significant in the way of delays you could strip things back further removing devices from the network till you find the cause.   It might show nothing but it will start to prove the stability of your network.

Regards

Paul

On Sat, 8 Dec 2018 at 15:16, C. van Ravenswaaij <cortec@...> wrote:
Kriss,

Are you certain that there is only one DHCP server active in your network? If you use any, that is.
I have had strange client behaviour in my network, until I found out that, somehow, one of my AP configured routers had it’s DHCP function (re)activated after a firmware update. 

Good luck,

Cornel


Verstuurd vanaf mijn iPad

Op 8 dec. 2018 om 13:36 heeft Kriss Kliegle <kliegle@...> het volgende geschreven:

Yes, IPV4 network, all servers have a fixed IP (won't work outside via the WAN without them)
I even removed a switch and a LynkSys (DD-WRT flashed) router and problem still remained (see diagram above in msg #44315) between Client computer #1 and SDR-iq Server #2 & #3. Still the same behavior, but if I connect to any of my SDRplays, (SDRPlay #2 is not shown on the above diagram since it was removed for testing) no issues what so ever going through the same series of switches at 1 MHz bandwidth.

I do have long runs of CAT6 from house to barn ~250' and from barn to repeater shed ~150', but as previously mentioned some SDR's work fine and some not so good via select clients. I spend most of my computer time using my XYL's 10 yr old Laptop, the one running the AirspyHF+ server. That old machine accesses all my SDR's just fine, go figure!

Will try the NETSTAT diagnostics this AM....

73 Kriss KA1GJU

C. van Ravenswaaij
 

Kriss,

Are you certain that there is only one DHCP server active in your network? If you use any, that is.
I have had strange client behaviour in my network, until I found out that, somehow, one of my AP configured routers had it’s DHCP function (re)activated after a firmware update. 

Good luck,

Cornel


Verstuurd vanaf mijn iPad

Op 8 dec. 2018 om 13:36 heeft Kriss Kliegle <kliegle@...> het volgende geschreven:

Yes, IPV4 network, all servers have a fixed IP (won't work outside via the WAN without them)
I even removed a switch and a LynkSys (DD-WRT flashed) router and problem still remained (see diagram above in msg #44315) between Client computer #1 and SDR-iq Server #2 & #3. Still the same behavior, but if I connect to any of my SDRplays, (SDRPlay #2 is not shown on the above diagram since it was removed for testing) no issues what so ever going through the same series of switches at 1 MHz bandwidth.

I do have long runs of CAT6 from house to barn ~250' and from barn to repeater shed ~150', but as previously mentioned some SDR's work fine and some not so good via select clients. I spend most of my computer time using my XYL's 10 yr old Laptop, the one running the AirspyHF+ server. That old machine accesses all my SDR's just fine, go figure!

Will try the NETSTAT diagnostics this AM....

73 Kriss KA1GJU

Paul Mclaren MM0ZBH
 

Kriss,

I am probably a bit late on the show with this but have you tried some captures with Wireshark?

You should be able to get a good idea of the network packets being exchanged with the server for a good client and a bad client.  It is time stamped so you can compare like for like you using the filters.  It might not give you an immediate answer but it could give you some evidence of what is happening if it is a network issue. 

Netstat will show what is happening at a point in time but as this seems to be intermittent then you need something for a longer time span.

Regards

Paul

On Sat, 8 Dec 2018 at 13:46, Kriss Kliegle <kliegle@...> wrote:
"Netsat -e " of the problematic SDR-iq #2 & #3 server:

Kriss Kliegle
 

"Netsat -e " of the problematic SDR-iq #2 & #3 server:

Kriss Kliegle
 

What suffix shall I use w/the Netstat cmd?

Kriss

herbk@...
 

Kriss:
Your SDR-iq #2 and SDR-iq #3 both play well on my primary (client and server) desktop BUT DO NOT play on any
clients (desktop, laptop, wifi, or networked ethernet) in my LAN. The stuttering and latency make not a word intelligible most
of the time. 
Yet G4ELI is stutter-free and latency free on ALL CLIENTS regardless of individual specs in the same LAN. 

Of course, I could continue to look for additional servers that do/do not play on the clients but I don't think that
would tell me anything additional. I do have KA1JGU and G4ELI logfiles saved on all these machines and have gone through them
and note the difference being.

1) CUDA initialization fails on several machines (I attribute this to the graphics capability of the different machines).

2) After confirming buffering specifications (thresholds and limits) and flow control sleep 5 ms (restart timing) , the clients never
get to the "execution state = continuous" and play but and simply go into "constant restarts" occasionally providing short bursts of readable signal, sometimes never.

I assume this info in the logfile doesn't tell me much.

I cant recreate your setup here as my LAN is far less complex: the Xfinity Gateway/Modem operating bridge mode to the ASUS
RT-AC88U wireless router serving various including two gigabit switches down-the-line. Typical speed tests from IPv4 and IPv6 return 230 Mbps down and 12 Mbps up on the LAN.

I have the Cloud IQ ethernet based SDR which plays with no issues to any / all clients on the LAN. As I recall, I noticed  issues started when I wanted to put the Airspy HF+ (non-ethernet SDR) available to my clients. Or at least, that was my
first encounter.

Sorry I don't have more to offer.

73
Herb

Kriss Kliegle
 

Yes, IPV4 network, all servers have a fixed IP (won't work outside via the WAN without them)
I even removed a switch and a LynkSys (DD-WRT flashed) router and problem still remained (see diagram above in msg #44315) between Client computer #1 and SDR-iq Server #2 & #3. Still the same behavior, but if I connect to any of my SDRplays, (SDRPlay #2 is not shown on the above diagram since it was removed for testing) no issues what so ever going through the same series of switches at 1 MHz bandwidth.

I do have long runs of CAT6 from house to barn ~250' and from barn to repeater shed ~150', but as previously mentioned some SDR's work fine and some not so good via select clients. I spend most of my computer time using my XYL's 10 yr old Laptop, the one running the AirspyHF+ server. That old machine accesses all my SDR's just fine, go figure!

Will try the NETSTAT diagnostics this AM....

73 Kriss KA1GJU

Oidar
 

Hi Kriss

Your problem seem related to general IP and networking issues, rather than Simons software, just some simple tips below based on what we know of your network.

Do you use a IPv4 or IPv6 network, if the answer is v4 continue below.
   
    If you use DHCP, try to give all servers static IP addresses you may even try giving the clients static addresses.
    Have you checked and double checked the network settings on each and every server and client, such as gateway, IP adresses and subnets?
    Do you see any anomalies using a networking diagnostics tool such as NETSTAT at each server or client?
    Have you tried swapping place of computers or switches in the network, and noticed any difference on the behavior?

//Mats

Kriss Kliegle
 

Welcome to my hell.
My most powerful computers, the two desktops, exhibit this problem within my LAN as explained previously, but yet an old i3 laptop works just fine on all servers w/in my LAN. All are Windows 7 variants, and hardwired.
Strange thing is the SDRPlays I have work fine, even at 1MHz bandwidth, from the desktops. Two of the SDR-iq’s and the AirSpyHF+ don’t play well with the desktops, but work OK via WAN users.

BTW, the AirspyHF+ wouldn’t work as a server at all on my netbooks that handles the SDRPlay just fine. So I moved it to my XYL’s i3 laptop.

Puzzling this issue.

73 Kriss KA1GJU 

herbk@...
 

Can anyone help with this? 
I have every client in my LAN enjoying stutter-free audio and control with G4ELI server. 
It simply works, no issue. In all clients: Desktop, Laptop, WiFi.

Many other servers present excessive stuttering audio and control latency, some of which are completely unusable. INCLUDING my own effort with the Airspy HF+ with V3 server in the LAN.

Any way to cut through this and start looking to explain? 
My apology if this exposes my lack of networking (or other) knowledge.
But I simply don't have what it takes to continue to resolve without anything
further.

73
Herb